263: She Almost Lost Her Marriage to Build Her Business — Here's How She Got Both Back | Tiffany Sauder
In this episode, we sit down with Tiffany Sauder, former CEO of Element Three and founder of the Life of And Movement. Tiffany gets incredibly vulnerable about her journey through severe burnout and deep dissatisfaction in her marriage, business, and family life between 2018 and 2019.
Instead of walking away from it all, she created a system to save it. Tiffany breaks down her transformative "Life of And" framework—a practical Venn diagram of Self, Family, and Career—to help you identify your imbalances and finally achieve sustainable fulfillment without sacrificing the things you love.
In this episode, Tiffany shares:
✳️ The Breaking Point: Tiffany’s raw story of hitting a wall in 2018 and how she realized something had to change.
✳️ The "Life of And" Framework: How to map out the Venn diagram of your Self, Family, and Career.
✳️ Overcoming Burnout: Practical steps to stop the cycle of exhaustion and resentment.
✳️ Redefining Success: Why you don't have to choose between a thriving career and a happy family.
If you found value in this episode, please leave a comment below sharing your biggest takeaway, and don't forget to like and subscribe! ✨
Chapters:
00:00 — Introduction and Tiffany's Personal Journey
02:30 — Helping High Achieving Women Stop Living a Life of Have To
04:04 — The Turning Point: Life Fell Apart in 2018-2019
05:22 — Acknowledging Where You Are and Building a New Life
09:14 — Introducing the Life of And Framework
12:21 — The Unbalanced Characters and Their Toolbox
16:36 — Feeding the Circle to Restore Balance
20:40 — System Changes and Their Impact on Life
29:34 — One Small Decision to Move the Needle
30:00 — Practical Tips
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Read the Transcript
In 2018, 2019, like life just fell apart in a really big big way. It's like I'm exhausted and I don't know what else to do. And I started to realize I have to build my life where I'm not in seasons of feast and famine. Every day is sustainable. My goal when I have guests on this show is to bring you people who are doing big things. Entrepreneurs, business leaders, thought leaders who are breaking the rules and showing us what's possible when you stop playing small. I'm gonna stop doing everything I don't like to do and I'm going to be motivated to earn to make those things go away.
Tiffany Sauder is the founder of the Life of And movement and former CEO of Element 3, a marketing agency she grew onto the Inc. 5000 list six years in a row. She's also a wife, mom of four, podcast host of Life of And and speaker. Where you have to start is actually acknowledging where you are. Life fills up. It's begging for your attention. And the question is, how bad will you let it get before you pay attention to it?
Before we dive in, I want to invite you to become part of the She Thinks Big community. A place where ambitious women learn to think bigger, take bold action, and create the life and business they actually want. All you need to do is to hit the subscribe button. I am so grateful you're here and honestly we're just getting started. Your support means everything to me. So, thank you for subscribing.
Tiffany, thanks for being here. Or maybe I should say thanks for having me here into your studio. Yes, this is so fun. We're doing a swap today. Super fun. Super fun. So, okay. We literally just finished recording on your show, Life of And. And if you haven't heard that conversation yet, make sure you do. I'll link it in the show notes. But now I get to flip the script and I'm going to sit back here and relax and ask you all the questions, which I love.
So, okay. So, let's just jump in. Um, you help high achieving women stop living a life of have to and start building a life they actually love. But I know you didn't always have this figured out. Is that true? What would you say was the turning point for you? What happened?
Yeah. Yeah. I um I think most of us who are in the sort of content world, you know, we're wanting to teach the thing that we most—the life the lesson life most taught us or the thing that we wish we had known. And that's definitely what the Life of And project is about. Um yeah, my husband and I both have big careers. We're both firstborns and so there's a lot that comes with that. Yeah. So, it's amazing to be a firstborn high achiever. It also comes with a lot and so we're trying to do that together. We've got four kids that we had across um 11 years.
And we were in this season of performing and achieving and getting a lot of feedback from the outside world that we were doing a great job. And so, you know, as you do, you just keep pushing and you keep saying yes and you keep adding. And in 2018, 2019, like life just fell apart in a really big big way. Um, our marriage got to a place that was just really scary. We had a conversation in the kitchen that you think is never going to be you. Um, where we looked at each other and said, "We both deserve better than what this is and what we're putting forth for one another and not knowing whether we'd move forward together or not."
My business by all external, you know, perspectives was doing very well. We were growing a ton. We were getting a lot of attention for that, but we were making less money every year and I was getting rewarded less for the risk that I was taking and would lay in bed at night feeling like, man, I I might actually be smarter to go get a job because this is—it was paying me, but not in the way that it it should have been.
Um, and I was unhappy with the way that I was showing up for my girls. You know, I'm I'm grateful that they were young enough that I don't think they'll look back and say mom was not present, but I was physically there, but I wasn't in it. I wasn't present. I I was physically there, but I I would didn't en—I didn't enjoy their birthday parties. I wasn't creative with them. I I was just like—it was just like one more place I had to be, one more thing I had to do. And I looked the part, you know, I had on pencil skirts. I walked fast. I had a you know, a bag that was going somewhere and my lipstick on and it like looked good. Um but I didn't know where to go when everything started to fray.
And so my marriage was struggling, my business was struggling, I was uncomfortable with the way I was showing up for my family. And I was certainly uncomfortable with the way I was showing up for myself. And so it's like I'm exhausted and I don't know what else to do. And everywhere I look, everybody says, "Yep, that's kind of what happens. If you want a lot, you have to be tired." Um, so that was kind of the moment where I said, "I got to rebuild this differently."
So what did you do first?
The first thing you have to do is acknowledge the truth of where you are. And it's incredibly difficult because you have to release that you may not have it anymore. And so my husband and I saying we deserve better meant that we—better may be apart. And that's terrifying because it wasn't what I wanted. It wasn't what I had pictured. And I'm grateful to be able to say that we just celebrated 20 years. But it takes both of you choosing a new version of your marriage. And so it was—that was where we started. I think you have to triage the place that is bleeding the most.
And so that's where we started was on our marriage. It was taking so much capacity to walk into the house and be like uh and and you know ours was not this like hyper loud vicious fighting. It was just—it was passivity. It was being passive aggressive with one another. Yeah. It was just it was just it was just not it was it was just like we were not a priority for one another. we living adjacent lives and it was tiring to you know sort of work through that every weekend and it was tiring and so that was where we started but that where you have to start is actually acknowledging where you are and I think the avoidance can become a very familiar part of your routine and behavior because addressing how bad it is—your health, your relationships, your financial moment—all of that when it—it's begging for your attention and the question is how bad will you let it get before you pay attention to it.
So, you know, I talk a lot about belief. So, did you have to get to a place where you believed that you could have it all? Like what did—was that there underneath it always or was that—I I say I've always had a heart of "and" and I know the woman that you speak to does as well. I mean, when you say she thinks big. If you think big, you want it all.
Yes. And all to me was this life of "and." I want—I want to feel good in my body and I want to I want and I want to have a great marriage and I want to have a big family and I want to have a career that's fulfilling and I want to be able to give back to my community and I want to be able to be involved with my church and I want to have great—like I I couldn't look at something and say what is not important to me what is not a priority but I was in a situation where the priorities were sort of chosen for me in the sense of um I had a big financial commitment in my business. My dad had signed a personal guarantee for right at a million dollars on the lease that we had just signed as a business. And so while I I could have shut that business down, I could have let it go um for my own integrity, I would need to figure out how to pay that back to him. And that was very daunting at the age of 35 to think about how I would do that, plus provide for my family.
Um I had seen my best friend get divorced and I knew that even if our marriage was over that that was actually not going to fix anything. It was going to be hard. Yeah. Um in either and so and so the best case scenario was to do the hard work for us to get back together. And leaving your kids is like pretty awkward. So, you know, in this idea of like, did I choose "and" it's like sort of I just I had to make these ingredients of life fit together in a way that I was not exhausted, angry, reactive, and overwhelmed by it every single day. And those were the only words that I could explain what a day felt like.
Um, and I was like, this is not who I was. If you would have looked at me seven, eight years ago, people would have said like, I'm adventurous. I'm funny. Like, I love a good time. I've got tons of ideas. Like I was always starting new things. I was like, you know what we should do? And I had none of that energy in me anymore. I was just managing and not very well.
So, so you developed this Life of And framework. I got a little sneak peek um 15 minutes of it at one point a couple months ago, but I want you to share with listeners what is this? How did you put this all together in this Life of And framework?
Yeah. So there will—I'll talk about the unbalanced characters and that's I can go through that, but really it's a toolbox. This is what I observed. I started to realize as the mom, I am the chief operating officer of our home. So, every family or every company, let's start there, has three primary roles that the executive team has to play. And if you're a solopreneur, you're playing all three of these.
The CEO, which is really doing two things, setting strategy and values. A CEO does a lot of things, but but in a—that's really the executive function of a CEO is to set strategy and values—where are we going and and what's going to govern how we get there behaviorally. The CFO figures out how are you financially going to make your strategy happen? They figure out the money in and out and the COO figures out the operational infrastructure of it.
So it's like our household is the exact same way. What is our strategy? What is our vision as a family? And what are our values? What governs the way that we show up and behave? And I would say my husband and I sit in that seat together. the CFO role, he squarely sits in that seat. Um, and the COO role, I squarely sit in that seat. I am—I am running the trains, the ins and the outs and station. Yes. I am I'm the conductor. And so I was like, okay, I'm the COO of our household. Instead of being pissed about it, how about I just accept it?
Yes. Yes.
And just like in my work, there are days I don't want to show up and do my job, but what do I do? You show up. You show up and you do your job, right? And you kind of don't even think about that aspect, right? It's just responsibility because you pick the job. So, I was just told myself, I picked this job. There are going to be days that is going to be—I'm going to have a more natural energy towards doing this and there are going to be days it's going to be hard just like in my real job. So, just own the job, Tiffany.
So, then I started to look at it and say, well, a COO has a whole toolbox of things. They have systems to make the most ordinary things happen automatically. They are solving towards the innovative part of a company and helping those things happen more and they're there to support the people to be as happy and fulfilled and successful as possible. What a cool role. What a cool—when I reframed it to myself like that, I'm like, that's my job as a mom in the way I'm operating our family. I have other jobs like teaching my kids things, but that's my job. I'm the COO.
So, I started to test and build this toolbox of things. So, there are things like processes and systems to help you make super easy things, super annoying things easy. So, they happen all the time. But this framework um that I'll get to here helps me understand why it is that I get pissed when my energy gets off and why do I turn into a wild person? Like, I'm no fun. Why am I not any fun?
So, this is what it is. If you're listening along and you can draw this out, then do it. So, think of Venn diagram. That's what we're doing. The first circle is yourself. The second circle is your family. And the third circle is your career. So, draw that out for yourself, you know, in your head or on a piece of paper. In the very center of that Venn diagram where all three of those things overlap, they're all fed and fueled and prioritized in a way that feels right to your season of life and to your priorities and outcomes that you want. That's your—that's nirvana. That's balance. That's Life of And. All this stuff is happening. I feel whole and like a priority in my life. I feel peaceful about the way I'm investing in my family relationships. And I feel fulfilled in the way that I'm investing in the outside world through my career or volunteering or whatever that looks like.
That's Life of And which that's helpful in and of itself because we say I want balance. I want it all. And I'm kind of like but what does it mean? I always say there's no such thing as balance because it's kind of like a teeter totter and you know you're balanced for one little split second and I love thinking about integration which kind of those—that Venn diagram is—those three circles are integrated right in that one space. Well and I would go one step further and say balance has nothing to do with time. I would agree. Yeah it has nothing to do with time but that's different podcast episode.
So those are—those are—that's our Venn diagram the center Life of And. So when we get out of balance, when we're not in the center, we fall into one of three places.
One is that we—we neglect self and we're feeding only family and we're feeding only career. That we become our Grumpy Servant. All of the things external to us are getting done. Every lunchbox is packed, every water bottle is filled, every, you know, permission slip, every game is attended, every jersey is washed, every what? Like, you know, whatever. The family is fed and fueled. Yeah. and your job is done. But at the end of the day, you're just pissed because you never experienced your own time or money. You didn't remember a meal you ate. You didn't ever prioritize yourself. You didn't get to the gym. You didn't go on a walk. You didn't feel the sunshine. You just executed other people's priorities for your time and you're mad about it. Mhm. That makes sense. Make totally makes sense. So this persona, I call it this unbalanced character takes over the way you interact, the way you walk, the where your shoulders are located, the tension in your face, and it starts to color your life.
The second one is when career and self are fed, but family is naturally neglected, and that is the Lonely Achiever. Okay. So, they're really good at managing self, really good at um hobbies and staying connected and really good at their job, but they don't know how to connect into the family or they can kind—I think you're like a hot air balloon and they're floating—they kind of float away and they start to feel like they're alone in the world. They're getting all of this external validation for their contribution, their achievement, how smart they are, how successful, but when they come home, they feel invisible. And so it starts to disconnect and you start to go obviously as you would into the outside world to seek validation. But they're craving that emotional connection of home. So when you're in that unbalanced character, you start to act a certain way and your energy goes to the outside um and you're not connected to home.
The third one is when you're—when family and self are most naturally fed and career, the outside world is very scary. And this is the Fearful Loyalist. Um, I see this persona show up in some of my working mom friends or you work with some women who go back to work or have a second career or they've been home for 15 years with their kids and then they're like, I'm venturing into the outside world. It feels so scary. My safety place is home with my kids or with myself and my friends or in my hobbies that I've developed. And so they get really fearful and they're stuck between their potential and their comfort. And it's like this, you know, I I picked like standing on the side of like Niagara Falls and be like, I'm just always almost almost going to go but never make the choice to actually.
So when I think when we can observe that outside of ourselves, we start to say, okay, the way I get myself out of my unbalanced character is to feed the circle I'm starving. That's the only way to get back into the center.
So, you know, my husband just went on a 4-day ski trip that he went right into 5 days uh at in uh Las Vegas. So, he was gone for 8 days, whatever the math is. A long time. And when he was skiing and I was home with, you know, a blizzard and gajillion degrees and the kids not going anywhere, I just wanted to call and scream at him. Yeah. Because I was jealous. Yeah. And it seemed unfair. But that's silly. Why would I take his joy? It doesn't change where we are. And me being able to say, "My Grumpy Servant wants to get on the phone with him and just tell him how grumpy I am." But that's going to do nothing for my marriage. It's going to be nothing for his experience there. It's going to be nothing to fix my mindset. I need to go outside and walk for 20 minutes. That's going to fix everything. And that's what I would do. So just knowing I don't want my Grumpy Servant to get on the phone with him. I want my balanced whole healthy self to get on the phone with him and I know how to do that. I feed the part of me that I'm starving.
Mhm. So, are they really in one of these personas or do you see them in both? Or is it more like one person in the marriage is in one and then the other person is in the other?
I think we can all float into different unbalanced characters in different seasons of our life. Um, and what I'll tell people is most often in a marriage, if you have both of you plot yourself on this little Venn diagram, you're usually in separate unbalanced characters. So, the only place to be together is when you facilitate one another's healthy wholeness into the center. That's the only shared space.
How does that usually happen? How did it happen in your case, I guess? Yeah. So, so was your husband in a different way?
Yes. I'm a natural Grumpy Servant and he is a natural Lonely Achiever. Okay. And so we have very explicit agreements in place that help us manage that. So here's what it looks like. I have minimums defined—thing that I teach—when what Grumpy Servants will often say "I need more me time." Right? What does that really mean though? Which is a weaponized way of saying "I'm not going to take accountability for my own happiness."
Yeah. So instead, if I tell my husband—I told—I said before I was like, I worked out this morning because I had before we started recording because I get how many did I say? Four. Four workouts in. That's my defined me time. Four workouts. They're programmed with this lady that I do. They take me about 35 minutes. That's my thing. So if my husband gets home from a trip or he's trying to figure out if he needs to take a kid to school or not, he'll say, "How many workouts have you gotten in this week?" And if he knows if it's Friday and I say one, we both have a problem because I'm going to be grumpy. Yes. And he doesn't want to deal with that. So he—he helps facilitate me getting my four workouts in by saying, "Hey, how many workouts do you have in? Do you want me to grab dinner at the club with the kids? Can I take an—we work together to make sure I get my four workouts in." We as a team make sure that happens.
His is Lonely Achiever. He travels a lot for work and we have all girls and—ski and ski. He really is. I I really am so glad he could go ski and I really am glad he could go ski. It's important for him to go do something fun because he works very hard. But he travels a lot and we have all girls. Yeah. So girls, it's—they especially teenage girls connect very strongly with their mom and so we have to be really intentional together. Um and so we'll have family dinners within a couple nights of him getting home. Um, I texted him while he was on his trip and I said, "Hey, Valentine's Day is coming up. I think it would be really special if you texted the girls that you made reservations somewhere for all of us." So, I help him see what's coming by saying, "I know you want to show up for us in this way. You don't have the capacity to think about it right now, but I do. So, let me help you." Does that make sense?
Yeah, totally makes sense. So what changed for you when you started to implement some of these systems and different ways of thinking like—and do other people see the change?
Oh yeah. I mean um I mean my marriage is at a completely different place. I have the capacity—I mean I have two businesses. I have three businesses. I'm the majority owner of one that I operate day-to-day and I have operators for the other two. And so I'm like I'm able to run three. I don't run three businesses like in executive capacity, but I'm I'm ultimately accountable for three businesses that have uh you know, eight figures in revenue—like you. So like there—it's a—it's a lot going on. I'm supporting my teenagers through the busiest season of their life and I get seven hours of sleep at night. Like it's—it's just not—it's not—it's busy. Yeah. But it's not crazy.
And one of my coaches told me burnout actually has nothing to do with busy. It has everything with doing more work and not getting progress. So true. That's how that—I 100% agree. And so I'm—I'm busy, but I see so much progress in my life in a way where I was just reacting um to what the day had, reacting to what the kids needed, reacting to the problems in the business, reacting to the fights we were having, reacting to, you know, what dinner what we were going to have for dinner, reacting to laundry needed to be done. Like nothing was on a plan. And so there's an incredible amount of proactive posture to our week.
Um, I've worked really hard to not just—I started to realize as you get further in your career, you make more money. Uh, the—the obvious thing is to buy more things. Yeah. And I started to buy more time. And so as my husband and I made, you know, more money every year, we would outsource one more thing. I love that. So think about, you know, especially your women who are in a capacity to control their earnings. I started to realize doing laundry for a family of six takes me eight hours a week. And so if I get rid of that, what do I—what could I do with that time? I could go to bed on time. I could work out in the morning. I could go on a date night with my husband.
And so we started to make the choice to get rid of those things that, you know, I—you go back to belief. I was like, "Oh, the Fresh Prince of Bel-Air doesn't do their laundry, but I'm not the Fresh Prince of Bel-Air. I need to do my own laundry." And I was like, "No, I mean, for, you know, $50, $60 a week, I can send it out and I don't have to touch it and it's not—it's visually the mess is not in my house. It's not a fight with anybody in my family. I don't get home and have to one more job waiting for me." And so I just started to say, I'm going to stop doing everything I don't like to do and I'm going to be motivated to earn to make those things go away.
Why do you think so many people when you're explaining this framework—I've—because I explained it even though I learned it in 15 minutes, I did explain it to a couple people and it was like this "aha, oh my gosh, I've never thought of it this way." That makes so much sense. What are we programmed—so like society-wise—not to think in this way? It boggles my mind when it's so—it's not rocket science, right? But it is in a sense.
Well, I think that up until this—I was able to draw this thing. I literally feel like God just was like, "Here you go." And I like I just drew it out. Literally, Sam was in my office and I was like, you know, I just came up with this thing and it just like came out of my fingers in 30 seconds. It was just like the weirdest thing. And I was like, this thing just came into my head. I think for the first time I was like, I do have agency over this because I would have conversations with women who were 5, 10 years ahead of me and I would be like, what are you doing? And they would just be like, "Honey, I'm tired, too. It's the only way. Just hold your breath and get through it."
And when I had our last, there was 11 years between my first and my last. Our last baby I had at 40 years old. And I was like, I don't have just these like little tray of kids moving through our house that are all going to be gone in like a three-year span. They're going to be there forever—for decades. Yes. We're never going to be without kids. And I started to realize I have to build my life where I'm not in seasons of of feast and famine. Well, this whole "every day is sustainable." I hear like, "well, we're just in this season," right? "We're—it's just the way it is right now." And I don't necessarily think it's a mirage. Yeah, it's absolutely mirage. Um, everybody who has young kids that aren't sleeping through the night thinks as soon as this baby sleeps through the night it's going to be easier. As soon as they are in middle school and they can shower them, you know, as soon as they can drive, as soon as they—It's like, no, I'm telling you, at every season, life fills up. And until you decide to say, I'm in control. I can be proactive. I can put things in place so that I'm not responding all day long. And I mean it—it took learning and testing and trying, but it's trainable. It's teachable. Just like this framework, it's like silly obvious. Yes. Um and when you do it a little bit every day, it creates a transformed life.
It happens. I think go back to the seasons. So when you said that, I think people feel once the kids go to school, then I'm going to get to go in a different circle, right? like that circle then is all of a sudden that's going to be my focus, right? But what's interesting about that is okay, so if that becomes your focus, then what happened to the other two? So it really isn't shifting focus one versus the other. It is this and the weather.
It's also about creating peacefulness about what can I give this right now. So for example, when I had Quincy in the middle of COVID, she was born in 2020. I was leading my agency. My husband was—an is an executive capacity. We're both leading companies from home. I just have a baby and three other people running and I have three other people who are doing online school. Sam was at our house trying to help us keep things. I—the idea of being able to like have a fitness routine that would get me ready for a bikini contest. Yeah. That choice does not have any context or relevance for everything else going on. I think the other thing Life of And teaches is to say in the context of the other things you've chosen what is possible. Yes. Because not everything is available to you unless you're willing to say a massive no or not right now to something else. And that's okay. You get to choose that. You tease it. You get to choose it. You have authority over your life.
You do. And I think the relevant thing is really important. Um I often use smarter goals like with an ER at the end. And that other R is relevant. Is this relevant right now? Does this align with where we want—who we want to—who I want to be and what we—I believe anything's possible, but is it possible and relevant given the situation, then that's important to assess. I think the biggest part about goal setting and smart goals—and not the smarter that you're saying, but smart goals as they're sort of educationally defined. Yes. is the T.
The time-bound nature that we're taught to create goals, I think does not translate into the complexity specifically for a working mom. So, we say, we'll use health as an example because that's usually a ubiquitous uh goal is to say, I'm going to lose 10 pounds by spring break. Yeah. And if I get three weeks out from spring break and I'm not on track, what do we do? Give up. We quit. Right. And then never—and then next time you even think about it, you're like, well, that didn't work last time. you remind yourself of where you didn't—and and it's like something major may have happened. Maybe you sold your house. Maybe a kid had a big accident. Maybe they made the state championship and you had—I—I'm just like, yes, maybe something happened where the time nature of your goal needs to be extended for good reason because other context came in. But because you had set a date by which you suddenly threw out the whole plan instead of saying I need to renegotiate my minimum right now.
Now I'm in a season where I can work out. I can get four workouts in. When we were going through the holidays, packing up our house, moving into our in-laws, getting a third of our belongings into our other house to stage this one, and putting the rest in storage, like I—I—I was not—I was not in a two-month capacity to be able to do what normally is normal for me. And so I scaled it down. Yep. I just remade the decision going into what I knew contextually was changing. It's not sustainable. I call it minimum baseline. So it's like the same sort of—it gives you agency back. So that's really the whole thing about Life of And.
Love it. Love it. So, all right. If someone's listening and they're thinking, "This all sounds great. This all sounds great, but I don't know if I have the time to rebuild my entire life. I mean, what's one decision that they could make this week that would actually move the needle?"
Yes. Uh, start doing two meetings. Two meetings: a planning meeting where it's you and your calendar and you look ahead at the week and you see everything that's coming both for you personally, for you in your job and for your family. And a family meeting where you spend 20 minutes or whatever it takes going through everybody's week to say who's picking you up, who's dropping you off, what snacks do you need, what's coming up, what's crazy hat do you need to have on Thursday, and just get ahead of what's coming. That's the only thing you do. You'll find capacity.
I love that. and send your laundry out. That is key. I have done that before. Send your laundry out. Try it for—doesn't have to happen right now, but I did do that at one point. Was it—was life-altering. Yes. If you're in Indianapolis, I don't know what most you people aren't. Some of them. Call the laundry valet. She's amazing. Courtney, literally, she's amazing. She will take more care of your clothes than you will of your own. I promise.
Does she come and put it back in your drawers? I mean, that would be—No, but it's—if you've got kids, it's these little piles and it's perfect. These people are professionals. Stop doing your laundry. Please stop.
All right. Well, that—if anyone takes away one thing, this is "stop doing your laundry." But I hope they took way more away. So, thank you for inviting me here and having me. And if you're listening, make sure you listen to both podcasts because, you know, I'm really about this—a lot of this internal and Tiffany kind of brings in the external and together I think you'll have a great package of listening. So, we'll have it all linked in the show notes.
Where can they find you?
Yes. I—I mean, jump over to my podcast, Life of And, just like you. Everything's called She Thinks Big. In my world, everything is called Life of And. Um, if you want uh we have a a program that's $25 a month where you get live content and access to our entire library. So, we'd love for people to join us. Thanks.
Yeah. Awesome. Andrea, thanks for having me.
Happy to have you.
Thanks for listening to She Thinks Big. I am Andrea Liebross and I am so glad you joined me for this one. If today resonated, the best thing you can do is share it. Send it to a woman you know who's been sitting on a price increase. Leave a review and follow the show wherever you're listening. If you're on YouTube, yes, we are on YouTube, subscribe so you're the first to know when new episodes drop. And for Straight Talk between episodes, come find me on Instagram at andrea.lbros.coaching. If today's conversation made you think, "I want more of this," I would love to invite you into a chemistry call. Just text the word "connect" to 317-245-3255 and let's talk. See you next week. Till then, think big.
